Things to Think About When Choosing an eCommerce Platform | Brandi Bernoskie

Matt Edmundson

Well, hello and welcome to the e commerce podcast with me your host Matt Edmundson. It is great to see you great that you're here. If you're watching on the live stream as we do the live recording, please say hi join in with the comments. If you're listening to the audio version or watching on catch up, a big, warm welcome to you. Now whether you are just starting out, or whether you're like me, you know a bit of a, let's just call ourselves a dinosaur. We've been around for a while, right 2002 was when I got started in ecommerce, I don't know about you, it may be 2021, it may be as far back as 2002. Wherever you are on that journey, my goal is to help you grow your ecommerce and digital businesses with this podcast. And to do that I get to talk to amazing people from the world of e commerce, I get to ask them all kinds of questions about what they know, what they've learned, and how it's going to help us grow our own online businesses, our own e commerce businesses, yes, I say that I try and have the conversation that you would have with them. If you got to sit down with him for half an hour and have a cup of coffee. Yes, it's that kind of, you know, just a casual conversation. One of the things I'm really keen that we do is dig into their story, and learn the principles that they're sort of locked in their heads that really are those amazing principles that are going to help us start and adapt and grow online. So if you enjoy this episode, I would appreciate it if you like it. If you're watching online, subscribe to our YouTube channel, or our audio podcast, but also share it out with your friends, colleagues, let the world know what's going on. Tell them to come on over and join in because we enjoy what we do. Oh yes. And on this week's eCommerce podcast, we are chatting with digital strategist, Brandi Bernoskie, and we're going to do we're gonna have conversations about how to choose right listening, how to choose the perfect ecommerce platform for your ecommerce business. This is important, right? Because think about the sheer number of options that are out there. This is definitely a useful topic to get into. Because you know, if you if you are starting out today, then you need to know what platform to use. But if you're like me, and I've been around a while, where you're always thinking about do I migrate, do I upgrade? Where do I go? What do I do? And so we're going to get into that whole conversation around platforms. because trust me, this is going to keep coming up in your ecommerce business time and time again. It's worth having. Now Brandi began her career as a blogger, teaching ourselves the ins and outs of WordPress Oh, yes. Before her friends began to notice and asked her for help with their own websites. I cannot begin to tell you how many businesses were started up exactly like that you were doing something a friend saw it and said can you help? It's amazing, really. And so she began freelancing like many people do. And things came along bigger and bigger and better until she found herself hiring staff and grown an agency she founded Alchemy and Aim in 2013 naming it for the transformation that takes place when the science of technology of web development meets that most human aspect of what those websites were designed for. I just like anything with the word alchemy in it. I think it's brilliant. I really like that word. Now Brandi has since worked with people. We were talking about this offer actually, some of the clients that she's worked with Renee Brown, will be on top of that list who many of you have heard about, you'd have watched her TED Talks. Apparently, he's even got a show on Netflix right now. Laverne Cox and many others. So brandy has worked with some pretty big names. And so I am super excited to be getting into this. Let me tell you, and as I said, having been around for a while. This for me is perhaps one of the key areas of pain that keeps rearing its head. So I have got my notebook. Oh, yes. I hope you've got yours and your pen. But if you haven't, you'll be pleased to know of course that all of the notes from today's show will be available as a free download on our website. All you have to do is head on over to eCommercepodcast.net/61. Yes, this is Episode 61. So just head on over to eCommercepodcast.net/61. And you'll be able to download the notes and the transcripts you'll get all of Brandi's links as well as the ability to maybe claim the freebie which we're going to talk about freebie is not even if it's a giveaway. This is an amazing thing that Brandi's going to do later. So do stick around for that if you want to know more. We're going to talk about more about that later. So there's a lot there. Now without further ado, let me press my magic button. And I'm going to bring Brandi onto the show Brandi Goody. Good evening. Welcome to you. How are you doing?

Brandi Bernoskie

I'm great. Thank you so much for having me here, Matt.

Matt Edmundson

Absolute pleasure. Let me tell you now, you are in New Jersey. I'm in Liverpool. I think that must mean there's like a five hour difference between us. But you know for those of you who are listening to the show, we both look really fresh and awake and going for it. Yeah, absolutely. It's great that you're here. So New Jersey, right? Are you from New Jersey? Did you? Did you sort of end up there? In another life? How did that work out for you?

Brandi Bernoskie

Both. I think I did grow up originally here in New Jersey, moved to New York City for school, then to San Diego, then down to Washington, DC and Virginia, and eventually returned to New Jersey. We bought a house here about a year and a half ago. And it is three tenths of a mile from my dad's house where I grew up. So I have sworn I would not let this happen to me. But it did. And I am really grateful to be so close to family, especially right now. Where it's been difficult for a lot of people to travel and be close to him.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, yeah. I mean that if you said 18 months ago, that was perfect timing.

Brandi Bernoskie

Yeah.

Matt Edmundson

I mean, yes, it was perfect timing, from your point of view. So oh, wow. Well, I have some good friends in New Jersey. It's one of those states that I hear a lot about, I've never actually been to, but it has fascinated me because my my one of my main websites is called Jersey Beauty company, right? One of my main ecommerce businesses, not referring in any way to New Jersey, but the original Jersey, you know, the small island off the north coast of France, which is a beautiful place, let me tell you. But yeah, I really should go one day, I understand is probably slightly overshadowed by New York, I would have thought.

Brandi Bernoskie

It is in many ways. But there are some great features of New Jersey certainly like, you know, we've got access to so much. That's really why I decided to stay here like not only access to my family, but I'm an hour from New York, I'm an hour and 15 minutes from Philly, I'm like three and a half hours from Boston, three and a half from Washington DC takes me a half hour to get down to the shore, an hour to get into the mountains. So there's so much so easily accessible in New Jersey, that it just makes it one of those places that you it's hard to not be here, really.

Matt Edmundson

So it does sound it does sound ideal. So you're based in New Jersey, Alchemy and Aim, your company is based in Jersey, Jersey, am I right?

Brandi Bernoskie

Yes, I am based in New Jersey, my team is actually entirely remote. I've set it up from that way from the beginning. And partly because I never knew where I would want to settle. I still am not sure I want to settle in New Jersey, like TBD on that one. But it's always it's always been remote, which has also allowed my team to, to make the moves that they've needed to make as well. So it's been very supportive overall. So I am based in New Jersey, but you know, we're really kind of like, I mean, not even national team. Like we have a team member in the UK, we actually have two in the UK right now. One in Poland, one in Egypt. So really, we just look for the best people wherever we can find them.

Matt Edmundson

And that's the beautiful thing, isn't it that you know, with the with the way working is become at the moment, everyone is now accepting that this remote working thing is actually a pretty good idea. Yeah, you've obviously been doing it a while. This is not what we're going to talk about. But what's perhaps the key thing that you have learned from the whole remote working thing.

Brandi Bernoskie

Um really how to improve communication, it, I think it's crucial that you have the right systems in place to be able to really communicate and connect with people, even though that they're far away. And I have to say, even though my team is all over the place, there's a very familial feel to the team. They get to know each other, they support each other, not just with like the tech side of the work they're doing, but also personally as well. And I'd like to see that. So we've really just made sure that the communication channels are open among the team members, but also between me and the team members and our leadership and the team members as well.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, sounds great. I mean, how so you talk about communication, having open communication, how have you, how have you done that?

Brandi Bernoskie

Primarily, like we use a lot of slack, for kind of general team communication support, things like that we utilise Basecamp as well for projects and kind of orienting things there. And then email and and a lot of video too like we do team trainings, on video calls together. We have regular team meetings as well. And really like I look for opportunities wherever I can to hop on a call with a team member. Same thing happens with clients like the more face to face time you can have even if it's virtually the better.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, yeah, that's, that's great. I mean, the whole thing about communication for me is really powerful and trying to figure out ways I mean, we use slack ourselves. We don't use Basecamp, but we do use slack. And we seem to have, like many people at the moment, a lot of zoom calls, do you know what I mean, a lot of those sort of video calls. Have you found that your team's kind of got the zoom fatigue going on?

Brandi Bernoskie

I don't think so. I personally may have. I think I'm probably in the minority of it. I mean, because so much of the company has already been set up remotely, I don't think much changed. For most of our team members. It's really been my time, I think that has been, like I am finding myself sometimes on like, eight hours of zoom calls a day. And I, you know, have started to get a little zoom. I wouldn't even call it zoom fatigue. It's almost just screen fatigue. Yeah, overall, you're just like, I can't look at the screen anymore.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, I'm with you on that. I just have to just get out and go for a walk around the park. So we have a local park that's maybe 10 minutes down the road. And I, I find myself now doing more and more zoom calls on my phone, walking around the park. I'm tempted to get I don't know if you've seen them, those those things you put around your neck, which kind of hold your phone out here. And so I could just walk around without even holding my phone? I've not I've not gotten that far yet. But you know, it's crossed my mind.

Brandi Bernoskie

Yeah, that's crossed a certain line to like, sometimes we should just get outdoors and not bring your technology with.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, yeah, I think yeah, I think you're probably right. I think you're probably right. So let's get into I mean, people tuning in again, hang on a minute, I thought we were talking about e commerce platforms. We are we are we'll get to that. Right now. In fact, let's jump into that e commerce platform. So what experience Have you had brandy with this whole ecommerce platform thing? I mean, what's your journey there? What's your story?

Brandi Bernoskie

Yeah, we've been building ecommerce sites for clients, really, almost since the beginning. And I will say, the way ecommerce looks for every business is different. It just varies. And I will say like I even have some clients who are in the same line of business. And their tech stack is different. You know, they may be on the same platform, but they don't use all of the same apps, they don't have all of the same features. It really does. I really think it's important that when you're considering which platform is best for you, you understand what what your businesses and and where you're going to get the most support for the type of business that you have. There are some platforms that are better than others, if you are drop shipping from multiple vendors and things like that, but also what you want the user experience to be overall to that's gonna vary. And there are times where I think it's totally great that a client if they're on Squarespace already utilises Squarespace as ecommerce feature because they're selling like digital ebooks or something like that. Yeah. But if you've got 10,000 products that are all physically shipping from multiple locations, you're going to need like square spacing income to do it for you at all, like you need a different solution at that point. So usually, the first kind of piece of the work that I do with client it clients is just understanding what does their business look like, and not just how it operates now, but like how it needs to operate going forward into the future for them to be able to grow and scale in the right ways. I think that's crucial, because so often, you're so just stuck in the day to day of what's going on in the business, that you're not taking the time to think forward as to like, okay, but what does growth and scale look like? And how can I position myself right now for those opportunities to grow and see when they come in? Because you don't want to find yourself having built for the moments you're in? And then being incapable of making those changes, as you do.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, no, it's very, very good. I mean, everything starts with understanding, doesn't it? And it's, it's such a crucial part of the whole thing. I mean, let's let me just rewind just a sec, if I can. Sure. For those who are listening to the show, that may be aren't familiar, I mean you mentioned Squarespace is one of them. What are some of the key platforms that are out there? So let's just name drop for a little minute here that people here may may or may not be familiar with these big let's have a quick namedrop

Brandi Bernoskie

Yeah, just a couple of big ones. Obviously Shopify is a big one. A lot of ecommerce can be done on WordPress as well. Amazon, I mean, you're not going to get a custom website necessarily through Amazon, but a big ecommerce platform that you know, you as a vendor can put products on. Etsy is another great one that a lot of people who are in the kind of antique or crafting area have gotten starts on big commerce is another one Big Cartel. I'm not actually sure. Like I think Big Cartel is still around I've had a lot of clients migrate either to big cartel or from big cartel depending upon their needs.

Matt Edmundson

I'm not familiar with big cartel. I mean, I'm not quite but I I've never come across it as a platform.

Brandi Bernoskie

Yeah, it's it was I had a couple of clients who were on it like who again, like it was kind of almost like the, either the next step from Etsy or a kind of a competitor to Etsy where they wanted a little bit more kind of a custom look and feel and not to be like lost in the Etsy shuffle, which actually is sometimes good, frankly, if you're fine double on in a location where people are searching for a lot of things. Yeah, um, but I like they're not they're not necessarily the platform like that. I would like point people to right away. And that, you know, but again, like even any of these platforms, it's kind of a matter of like, what are you selling? Who are you selling it to? Like? How can we make you most findable? And how can we craft the best experience for the people who are actually using you?

Matt Edmundson

Yeah. So and the other one you mentioned, I'm just writing them down. Here we go, Shopify, WordPress, Amazon, Etsy. big commerce, big cartel, I'd probably throw a few others in there, like Magento is quite popular. And Squarespace you mentioned is quite popular. Wix. Okay. platforms like Kajabi, if you're doing digital products, these are all starting to become quite well known. And so that I guess the point I'm trying to make is here, Brandi, there's, there's a lot, right.

Brandi Bernoskie

There's a lot. There's, there's more than I could name. And there's more than I can even know about sometimes, like, just if you're selling like a digital membership, or course, there are so many platforms out like that open up to you.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, there are. And so I guess, before you were, I guess what you're saying is, before you even think about which one to use, let's first understand the business - where you are, where you want to be. And let's understand that. So what are some of the questions that you would ask clients may be in that phase of understanding?

Brandi Bernoskie

So preliminarily, I want to get an understanding of the type of products that they sell, and are they shipping? So for me like the the first distinction is, are you selling digital things? Or are you selling physical things? And those physical things, if that's the case, how do you ship them? Are they shipping from your internal warehouse? Are they shipping from multiple other warehouses? Or are you scanning them over to Amazon and Amazon's, you know, drop shipping for you? What does that situation look like? If we're talking about digital products, and I do want to understand what the digital products look like, and what is the method of delivery and engagement for the clients that are purchasing those digital products? So that's kind of like, really the foundation. Is it digital or physical? Possibly a combination? And how, like, what's the shipping fulfilment situation on both sides, really. Like, what's the experience of that?

Matt Edmundson

Yeah. So if you're, let me just run a few scenarios by then. So let's say we're, we're a small mom and pop shop, we've got a little store going on, we know we want to go online, and we sell baby clothes in our shop, and their physical products. What's and we're just going to ship them from our warehouse, I'm not bothered about dropship. Our warehouse, I'm going to ship them from our shop is what? It sounds posh, we've got a warehouse, the closet outback becomes our warehouse. What sort of things? Should I be thinking about there if I'm that kind of business?

Brandi Bernoskie

And so I think potential for scaling growth is really critical, like, what do you need to be responsible for as a business? So that means like, what foundations do, we need to put into place so that if your, your baby clothes go viral overnight, you know that you are going to be able to handle that traffic, fulfil those orders, things like that. So we want to put into some systems into place for growth, that we don't know what that's going to look like, necessarily, but we can start to speculate and put those things into place. And then I think there's a lot of like business needs. So it's a question of how are you going to ship things? What service are you going to use? If you're based in the UK? Are you going to ship to the US or not? You know, a lot of I've got a lot of product based businesses that cannot ship past the United States and Canada just because of the astronomical fees that would incur for shipping for their clients if they did so they sometimes restrict to some of the physical items that they have to certain areas. So we look at that we look at you know, here in in the States, there's, you know, sales tax and that differs. Sometimes, I mean, that differs per state. It can also you know, you can have additional sales tax requirements if you're in or around or shipping to certain cities as well. So we're really looking to make sure that all of kind of the business structure is in place so that you're not selling things and then later on are hit by um some sort of like state fee that you had no idea about, and that suddenly brings your profit. So making sure that those kind of like basic business needs are actually in place, I think is really, really critical. And then it's a matter for me to have like, if someone's selling baby products, like baby clothes, like, how, how many? Do you have variety? do you have? Like, does it make more sense to put you on something like Shopify? Or to get you started on something like WordPress, and that's just kind of the rumbling that we do with clients in order to understand what they really need?

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, that's, that's really fascinating. And I want to circle back something that you talked about here. And I think this is quite important. So if I'm shipping baby clothes from the UK, am I selling to the States or conversely, you know, if I'm in the States, my shipping outside the US and Canada and where shipping costs have become prohibitive? And actually, we had a little thing? I don't know if you're familiar with this, but we had a little thing recently called Brexit on this side of Yeah. And that screwed shipping up massively. If you were shipping outside of the UK, to Europe, I mean, was a nightmare for like two months. It's just about starting to get resolved now and we're we're in what month, month for just about hit month, five of the year. And so I think shipping has changed a lot over the last few months. I've noticed a lot of brands, and this I don't know if you've seen this actually or maybe it's just me, but I just wonder what you thought about this. I see brands retreating to a single country that were in multiple countries. A classic one is a company called No Bull. No, no bull as in the you know the cow thing B U LL, No Bull. Not very noble, but nobody anyway. And I they sell trainers, tennis shoes, right?

Brandi Bernoskie

I have a pair. I actually have two pairs. Yes.

Matt Edmundson

Right. So let me tell you my experience ordered from their website. At the start of April, I go onto the website, No bull project, and everything's in Sterling. All the prices are in Sterling, right? And didn't think anything of it. Because whenever I see Sterling, I'm just thinking, Okay, Sterling is great British Great British pounds I can buy in my own currencies is wonderful. And you never think is this shipping from anywhere in the world. You mean you just think I can buy its English Bish, bash, Bosh. So I buy two pairs of trainers, then I get an email from the company saying that we'll ship them but because it's International, they're going to take a little bit of time to arrive. I'm like, email them back going, hang on a minute. Hang on a minute. Is this not coming from England? No, no, they're coming from America. And then I have questions like, Oh, am I gonna have to pay import duties and all those sorts of things? And they're like, No, no, we're going to pay them straight off the bat. So they said that they would pay them and I wrote them an email back, which they never responded to, which surprised me saying you need to understand if you're sending me the US size of the shoe that I ordered, because I thought I was ordering off a UK site, it's going to be the wrong size. Because for whatever reason, every country likes to have their own different shoe sizes, right. But they sent these shoes, lo and behold, they're the wrong size. I send them back literally yesterday cost me 35 quid or about 50 US dollars to send them back. Okay. And if you go into their Facebook thing, there's all kinds of people from England now complaining about this. Anyway, this is not me complaining about No Bull, but it is what it is. What I'm what I'm noticing, though, is a lot of companies are now starting to retreat back into a CORE distribution. And so they are now wanting to use that to distribute worldwide as opposed to having distribution centres around the world. I don't know if you've noticed that or whether that's a phenomenon that only I've seen.

Brandi Bernoskie

It's probably not just a phenomenon that you only you've seen, most of my clients tend to be on the relatively smaller side. So they're going to have one or two distribution centres tops. And I would say I'm trying to think most of them are our I think US based. I'm trying to think if I have any others that are I don't have it. I don't think I have anyone who's ships physical products that's not US based. I have people who are in different countries like the UK who ship digital products, which is a different, you know, digital is a different story. But I'm not entirely surprised by it. I feel like there's there's just some changes that are happening as people to kind of try to navigate, you know, the way that the world is now and, you know, especially with everything that happened with Coronavirus, and like certain countries being shut down and not being able to get product out of those countries in the right ways. It's I think it's really caused people to reconsider, like how their business is set up and what they're doing with it.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it? Yeah, I mean, this comes back. I mean, the No Bull project where so I think comes back to what you're talking about with ecommerce platforms. Because if you if they're trying to understand their business, what it is they're wanting to do, what their opportunities are, their website is not meeting that right now. It's causing all kinds of problems. And they I think you Shopify, I'm gonna say Shopify, I'm fairly sure at Shopify, I can't honestly remember. But for whatever reason that platform is not meeting their business needs. And this comes I think, down to what you're talking about here is actually, I don't know, if they've sat down and gone, actually, what is it we need our website to do? What are the best? How do we best achieve that now? And can this platform that we're on do that?

Brandi Bernoskie

Absolutely. And sometimes the platform can, I will say, there's no platform that out of the box gives you all of the functionality you need, like magically built into it almost all the time, you have to add on the features, like you have to identify the features you need and add them on with Shopify, its apps with WordPress, its plugins or extensions or things like that, like, just nothing comes out of the box with like, everything. Because I mean, first of all, that would be a really bloated site. Yeah, not everything. But also its businesses are so different. You, you just can't give anyone a total once, you know, box solutions sort of thing.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, that's true. So I mean, this is, this is interesting isn't because now we're starting to get into the territory of what do I need help building my ecommerce website? Because you actually what you were you said, here is, yeah, I'm gonna take a step back, you actually need help in understanding what you want from your website, you need somebody to be able to ask you the right questions. because quite often, you don't know how to ask yourself the right questions. I think this is where, you know, the coaching consulting thing actually works out quite well. Because you do ask the right questions. How do you how do you go about doing what you've just talked about, you know, in terms of figuring out what plugins you need, or what extensions you need, or what apps you need, if you're trying to do this by yourself on a budget? Because you're just starting out?

Brandi Bernoskie

Yeah, I mean, I would say, minimally, hire someone for at least an hour's worth of their time to get some perspective, like, when you are inside, you know, they say when you're inside the jar, you can't read the label. And, and that's the truth. Like it's you get your business and you know what you need, but just even having someone do a strategic session with you so that they can ask you the questions, and kind of orient you in the right direction. That'll that's going to save you potentially 1000s of dollars, right there. And then from there, yeah, exactly trying. And a lot of people who are just getting into ecommerce, they want to take on functionality that they don't necessarily need from day one. So, you know, I see people who are just getting started, and they're like, I need gift certificates I need I need, I need to print cards, like gift cards from day one. And I'm like, you haven't even had a sale yet. Like, yeah, yeah, we can add things on in time, I think people forget that processes can be iterative, and, and evolve, like your store can evolve. It's not that you have to know everything from this moment right now. What you're going to need for forever and build it right now. Like you can build what you need, knowing where you're going, and then add on the pieces as you go, like, do you need to launch with printable gift cards? Probably not. But you know, in three, six months, you may start to see demand for those. And it's just good to be aware of that you don't have to have it all done. From day one, I think the most crucial thing to do is get your product up there and out. And even if that's like simple ecommerce setup, that's okay. Like, if you're going to do it yourself, I think it's important that you keep it simple. And I think it's important that you get someone else's perspective on it to at least make sure you're on the right platform for the growth that you're intending to have.

Matt Edmundson

That's such wise advice. I love that go by an hour of someone's time that knows what they're talking about, and just have a conversation with them and let them steer you in the right direction. I think that's so, so helpful. I think if I'd have had that right back at the start of our eCommerce career, it'd be interesting to see what mistakes and pitfalls I would definitely have avoided. But you know, what, back then? And people ask me this all the time, you know, how has the world changed since 2002? When we started? It's a lot, right? And one of the things that we one of the problems that we have now is there's too much choice there's too many platforms to choose from, and we and people become sort of paralysed by and they call it analysis paralysis. Don't they just come like which way do I go? I genuinely don't know. So I love that I love that get on the phone with somebody speaks them for an hour. This is what I want to do. What do you think where do I need to start? Such such good advice. So, so yeah, so we've got, we've we've started to get our understanding, we've started to, you know, whether we've got someone coaching us through that, whether we're, you know, doing that with a team internally or whatever that is that we're starting to get some understanding. Where do I go to next? What what sort of things do I need to think about next?

Brandi Bernoskie

I mean, I think once you have the understanding, then it's a matter of building it and not building it and being done with it. But building it and continuing to seek out new understandings about it. So you know, this is where you can't just put up a shop, hope that they show up like people don't show up just because you built a shop. I wish I wish they, you know, I wish they would do that on websites doesn't work that way.

Matt Edmundson

Both. I'd be independently wealthy, me and Mark Zuckerberg would be mates, do you know what I mean, but that kind of thing. But it just doesn't work out like that.

Brandi Bernoskie

Yeah, so it becomes a matter of like, once you have an understanding of it, and you go out and you at least build the initial, like version 1.0 of it, you have to think about how you're going to drive traffic there. And that's going to also look different for everyone. I know, people who have had great success with Facebook ads, and some who've had no success with Facebook ads. And some people who you know, same thing love Instagram, all their clients are there some people who love LinkedIn, and all their clients are there, it's it really becomes I think, when you have an online shop, it's it becomes becomes a lesson in understanding your customers and where they hang out. And how do they seek out advice about the products that they buy? Because I think that's one thing that has very much changed in the world, you can't just have like some sort of big brand and advertise anymore. Like there's a lot of word of mouth that happens from like person to person. And just being aware of that, you know, being aware that it's, you know, people promote products that they love on Instagram or Facebook and just being aware of where your customers are and how they're utilising your site and how they're utilising your products and creating relationships with them.

Matt Edmundson

Okay, so, um, so I mean, there's a lot there. So we've understood what's going on. And now we're kind of thinking, Okay, well, let's build it on a platform that makes sense for us. And you've given us some of that. I mean, we've mentioned some of the key platforms, I think we mentioned about nine or 10 of them, which you can go and look at and research. Do you have a platform that you personally use more than others?

Brandi Bernoskie

I would say we use about WordPress and Shopify 50/50. Okay, like it's kind of split, and that just simply a function again, of what the clients need. They really like

Matt Edmundson

What what breaks the dif was, I guess, what's the differences in between WordPress and Shopify? A few? What are some of the key things?

Brandi Bernoskie

So some of the key things are inventory and size of inventory. And really, like, is the ecommerce business? Is that the primary business? Or it is, is it complimentary to the actual business? So I do have some clients who are on WordPress, because their primary business may be training. And they also happen to have, like any commerce portion where they sell workbooks, and things like that. So in that case, it you know, for them, it makes sense that like we're selling three or four products, their primary income actually comes from a different stream. And we need to be able to educate and market to consumers in a different way. WordPress is a great platform for that. Like when it comes to Shopify, a couple of the types of clients that I have on there are like they their business is the ecommerce. I have a client who specialises in like antique and vintage drugs to clients who specialise in that. And in that case, because that's their primary business, like we need to be able to house upwards of 2, 5, 10,000 products that are being distributed and sent from different locations across the country to, you know, either within the country or beyond the country. So, for me, that's kind of like that's the least sometimes one of the CORE distinctions is, is the is the ecommerce. Is that piece the primary business or is it complimentary to the primary business.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah. And so if I'm hearing you, right, if it I mean, you kind of favour Shopify, if it's primarily ecommerce and WordPress, if it's complimentary, is a really clear split in some respects. But does Shopify do them better with inventory than WordPress?

Brandi Bernoskie

I think I think Shopify, I mean, WordPress does inventory very, very well. But Shopify, I look for Like the Shopify POS for clients especially like now we're getting into like you need to sync your online inventory with like in store inventory so that as you're selling things in store, they're being marked off online. And I do think Shopify has some kind of like better native features for that than WordPress does with WordPress, you kind of have to, you know, get another platform added in sync it up manoeuvred around a little bit. I love WordPress so much for digital orders. And I yeah, I'm like WordPress for digital stuff is phenomenal, even for kind of like straightforward, like physical eCommerce. It's also really, really good. But once I start getting into you've got a brick and mortar and you're sinking online inventory, and it's shipping from three different locations like Shopify tends to be the location I go to for clients.

Matt Edmundson

That's, that's really fascinating. And do you find are they both fairly easy to manipulate and programme and get them to do what you want to do?

Brandi Bernoskie

I mean, for me, yeah. I think so. Yeah. But this is what I do all day. So it that's a different question. I mean, for clients. for clients, it's always the case, when you're adopting new technology, there's a learning curve. And as long as you are willing to put in the time for it, or to hire someone who's going to put in the time for it, you're going to be fine, like, you'll be in a good position. So sometimes I tell clients, like, we're going to make the training videos, and you are going to pass them to your team members to learn like this is not something for the owner of the business to be, you know, in all the time and moving things around. But I think once you understand the fundamentals, it becomes easier to work with, it's just a matter of getting that those fundamentals under your belt.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, really nice. Fair enough. So the so I'm thinking Shopify, I'm thinking WordPress, and there are others out there, like we've mentioned, which you can go ahead and research. And you mentioned earlier, one of the things is like, do you really need printable gift cards? Do you? I mean, do you really need them? What are some of the other things that you see people going, I need this? And actually, you kind of go No, not right now.

Brandi Bernoskie

Some people want to implement things like abandoned checkout immediately. And I'm like, it depends upon their business. I'm like, actually, it's not going to serve your business the way that you think it's going to, or, you know, let's get people in and watch how they're using the site first, before you start adding on these additional features like, so I see that. I mean, honestly, they range like, everything from like, I need to set up a trade programme. And I'm like, yeah, we still don't have a website for you. So affiliate programmes are the other, you know, another big one, we just my business partner, and I just set up a new website, and we're selling digital products on there. And I was very emphatic. I'm like, I'm only selling digital products right now. And then we had an opportunity with a really close friend and collaborator, to promote something. And that is, when I set up the affiliate piece, I did not do it from day one, because I also didn't know exactly what it needed to look like. And it wasn't until I had that conversation with that collaborator, that I was like, oh, here's what I need to set up. And I'm even learning as I go along of like, you know, what, I can do this better. You know, like, I know all the pieces that we need to have that are possible, but it doesn't mean you have to have them from from day one, like I am adding them on, as it makes sense for me to add them on. And as opportunities arise. Not just because there's all these cool pieces, and I could add them all on like, again, it's I think it's just being aware of, of what your focuses and your goals are. And not you know, I think a lot of like entrepreneurs want to build the perfect website.

Matt Edmundson

And that isn't there is always going to go, it has to be perfect before I launch it. And everything within me is crying out No, because it will never be perfect. What's wrong with you, just like

Brandi Bernoskie

Well you don't know what perfect is because really, like, I just want you to sell things and make money like that is my goal number one for my clients, like let's make you sell things and make money. Then let's add on the refinements that help your business stand out and help you bring you know, clients back and all of those details. But we may not even know what those details should be until you start selling things and making money. And then also you can take that money that you make and reinvest it, which is great.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, do you, I mean, you obviously do find that a lot of your clients then will suffer from what I call sort of shiny object syndrome. Yes, you know, I need this because it's shiny or someone's talked about it or someone mentioned it on a YouTube video somewhere, you know, made them a gazillion dollars overnight kind of thing. How do you deal with that?

Brandi Bernoskie

It's really kind of having a conversation about like going back to the CORE of what their goals are and what their business is. And does it make sense for them. And also, does it make sense in the timeline that they want it in. Because I'm not saying it may not make sense for them. But it just may not be a now thing, it may be a in six months thing. But it is really important to me with the clients I work with, that we make sure they're building businesses that actually really support their health and well being and that our businesses they love, and not simply businesses made up of the the promise the magic pills of other entrepreneurs, like, here's all of your magic pills, this is how you have a seven figure launch for the first three days of your business and things like that, like there are no overnight successes. And there are no magic pills out there. There are great ideas and great strategies, and you can incorporate some of them. But not all of them may be right for you to like, you know, I don't do Facebook ads for my business, because I really intentionally choose to run my business in a different manner. Like that's really important to me, that I am aligning the energies of how I spend my time marketing with also what fuels me.

Matt Edmundson

So that's really interesting. So, I mean, we may come back to that. But that the, the idea that I as you were talking, the thing that I'm thinking of is slightly tangential is the guy that goes to the gym, not been to the gym before joins a gym the first time, and he sees a guy over in the corner doing something amazing with a weight and it's kind of like, I need to be able to do that, can I do that today? And the trainer is going no, when we need to work up to that kind of thing and make sure that that kind of thing is right for you. And it's a lot. It's a lot like that, isn't it with our websites, it's like you see a lot of these these things happening. You hear a lot of stories, but understanding what's right for you. And understanding the path that you need to take to get to where you're going is the most critical thing here. And not being distracted. Because you see some guy over there going, yes, this will change your life kind of thing.

Brandi Bernoskie

Exactly.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah. No, that's fantastic. I'm curious, then why? Why do you not use Facebook marketing?

Brandi Bernoskie

Just personally, I mean, I, I'm looking at it for two of my other businesses. And we're beginning to get into it for that. But personally, for our community, we have a very small team, I do not want to scale my team to like 50 people. So intentionally, I am keeping it small. And I am a relational person, I love meeting people and connecting with people. And that's actually how I've built the business over eight years. And it's worked really, really well for me, and I'm continuing to kind of like innovate around that, as opposed to I just yeah, it's like, overall, it's like, I just don't feel like it would be it would draw the right people, I'd have to put a lot of money into it. And I'm like I'd rather just just builds the relationships with people instead, it's so, so much more of what I love to do, and we've had results from it so.

Matt Edmundson

You see, I'm listening to you talk Brandi. And I think that's incredibly brave, because every man in his dog is telling you that you need to be on Facebook, doing Facebook marketing, and here you are going, well hang on a minute. No, because that doesn't make sense for me. I really like this, you know, the relational side of things and being secure with that and not panicking that you're missing out. I think that's, that's actually quite a brave thing. Because a lot of people don't do that. They just kind of think, Oh, no, I've got to do this. I've got to do this. Otherwise, I've got no business. And you mentioned before, actually, before we came live on air, this phrase that I wrote down, which I thought was lovely. You call it unexpected connections. Sounds like a book title, if I'm honest with ya. So what do you mean by that? This seems to be your business model. What, how do you define unexpected connections?

Brandi Bernoskie

They're really the kind of so obviously, we all have the direct network that we're connected with. But those people are connected with other people. And I think just being a person in the world with other people and being supportive of them. Like that's brought a lot of business my way. I I can't even tell you how many instances from the past of clients that I got, because I was a blogger, and I interacted with them as a blogger and got I mean, this was before I ever had a business. I bet I just I was a blogger, I interacted with them as a blogger, like I got to know them, we became friendly. Like we followed each other we kept in touch. And then suddenly they were like, oh, you're building websites. I have this client who needs help. I know this person who needs support or I need support. Like let's work together. So yeah, it's just it's the the kind of the natural referrals that have come into my life just because I'm doing my best to take care of people and just maintain those relationships and nurture them and support people. It's been phenomenal.

Matt Edmundson

That, you see, and this is where I think people miss it, isn't it with the whole Facebook marketing thing. And this is so critical. We did some analysis the other day and one of our ecommerce websites, and over the 4 million, 4 million pounds, so turned over 4 million pounds in a certain time zone timeframe. Out of that 4 million pounds 25% of it. So a million bucks came from new customers, which meant that three quarters of it came from people buying from that website more than once, do you see what I mean. And in fact, over half of it came from people who were bought on that website more than five times. And this, this for me is I mean, you're talking about it, you know, you when you put good out there when you do good when you sell good products when you have great customer service when you treat people well. Fundamentally, it's a bit of a slower game, but that always comes back always comes back. And I think it's I think it's the greatest untapped marketing potential that that most companies have.

Brandi Bernoskie

I completely agree with you. And like for anyone who's watched any episode of shark tank, when there is a product based business that's being pitched most often those sharks want to know, what's the like, what's the returning customer percentage because that is indicative of future success. Not like how many new customers can you acquire on a regular basis for one off sales but how many people are coming back to you over and over again? And how do you build upon that base and draw people from the one time customer into that recurring base?

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, that's fantastic. That's really, really good. Well, Brandi, listen, I feel like we could carry on talking about this for a lot longer. I say this to every every good guest that we have on the show you kind of go I'm just feel like I'm scratching the surface. But I'm also aware of the time and I want to be respectful of your time. And how do how do people reach you? How do people get a hold of you? They kind of listen to what you've said they've gone You know what I need to connect with Brandi? How do they do that?

Brandi Bernoskie

Easiest way that I tell people to do this is go to Alchemyandaim.com, head over to the contact page fill out the contact form. And that actually comes directly to me. Like there's not like some weird sort of process in between the only time it doesn't come directly to me is if I'm on vacation, which I am not on vacation because we're still kind of in a pandemic.

Matt Edmundson

Remember what a vacation was either is a long distant memory. Yeah,

Brandi Bernoskie

I keep planning. I know, I know, I keep planning them. And at some point, we will get back to one. But those forms do come to me and I reach out to the people. And I at least you know if I'm not the right person to support that person, I try to do my best to find the right person to support them.

Matt Edmundson

Fantastic. So alchemyandaim.com, head on over to the contact page. And Brandi will be in touch. That's fantastic. Brandi, listen, um one of the things I said at the start of the show was we were going to do a giveaway towards the end of the show right? And with we're in season six, this is something that we've started doing. And you have kindly said, right if for the first two people I think it is you've got two spots available for people who who can get a three month membership with your company called Interstellar support, which I think is a brilliant company name. I actually watched the movie Interstellar last night with the kids but that's another story. And so what's Interstellar Support? And what's included in that membership?

Brandi Bernoskie

Yeah, so Interstellar support is kind of my newest company. It's not very different. It's kind of just an extension of the work that we've been doing. But we kind of gave it its own place and life. So I'm co founder of that company with my business partner Miosha Boykin Anderson, and the membership there includes. So it's a three month membership. It includes discounted rates on any tech support or virtual assistant support that you need. We have different rates for, you know, our developers and our virtual assistants. And then access to the knowledgebase articles that we are working on and building and also access to the monthly founders call with me and Miosha where we really get on with our you know, our members and answer any sort of question. They have tech business, anything like that. So yeah, that's that's the deal. So two of those for two lucky people. Well, one of those each for each.

Matt Edmundson

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I get what you mean. There's two slots available. So if you would like to be in a chance with getting the giveaway, what you have to do is head on over to eCommercepodcast.net/61. Today's episode, scroll down the page and you'll see just a little form where you put your name and email address. That's it, just put it in there and we will inform you to let you know if you are one of the lucky guys and we'll connect you with Brandi over that and you can check that membership out. It sounds almost ideal like you were talking earlier about the the people that just need to jump on the phone and have a conversation with someone that knows what they're talking about? It almost sounds like that's what you're doing in that monthly call. That would be ideal. I think for people starting out and they've got questions, maybe, maybe just maybe try that. And you can find out more about that. All the links will be on the website, of course. Now, Brandi, thanks again, lots and lots of notes. And so it's always a good sign when I've got lots of notes. That's for sure. I just have to decipher my own handwriting. But no, that was really really insightful, really powerful. I loved that. You talked about just getting on the call, talking with somebody that knows what they're doing, really think and understand about your business first. And the rest of it kind of unfolds from there. Avoid the shiny objects, think what you need for your business. And you know what? Magic will happen, right? And obviously do anything marketing. I that was another thing that I wrote down, which was great. So, Brandi, listen, thank you so much for your time. I really, really appreciate it. Thanks for being with us. And thanks for being so super generous.

Brandi Bernoskie

Thank you for having me, Matt. It's been fun.

Matt Edmundson

Brilliant, thank you. Wasn't Brandi fantastic? Yes, she was is the answer to that question. I just love that. I love those kinds of conversations where Brandi just you know, she just shares what she knows without filters just tells you what it is. That is so valuable right there. Right. So you will see on the bottom of the screen if you're watching the live stream or the video, the link to this week's show notes eCommercepodcast.net/61 where you will be able to see the show notes the links the transcripts from today's show, if you weren't able to take notes, you want to go over it again. All of that is there as well as the form which you need to fill out if you want to enter this week's giveaway and get one of those two spots going to some lucky person that's for sure. So do check those out. Last week we did the book giveaway and I know some of you filled those in so they are going to get sent out the Adapt or Die books are getting sent out from Jeremy last week. This week, the competition is now a competition like as a competition as a giveaway. The giveaway is now open, and you can go and enter that. Why not see how you get on. Now if you are with us still, why not make sure you are subscribed to the show. And you can do that in a number of different ways. If you watch the show, head on over to if you want to watch the show youtube.com/eCommerce podcast you can see as there you can catch up on all the previous episodes. Facebook just search the eCommerce podcast. You just have to write the word "the" in front of it. Whereas YouTube is just eCommerce podcast. We are available in audio format on iTunes, Spotify and Stitcher and you can subscribe to those to your heart's content. Where I know most of you listening to this now we'll be on the audio podcast is still by far the most popular channel. So thanks so much for being a subscriber. Thanks so much for listening. If you're not already a subscriber on on the audio side of things, why not because you get free content every week, coming down into your listening device, whatever that may be. And you can hear some great podcasts I was listening to I was out driving early on just listening to the podcast. I'm thinking this is amazing. All this content for free. All I had to do was hit the subscribe button. So you know, don't let it stop you getting what you need, which is some great comment content about ecommerce, even if I do say so myself. Right. I think that is that for this week. Thank you so much for tuning in. Thanks for being part of the eCommerce podcast. Make sure you join us again next week as we are carrying on our conversations with some amazing guests around eCommerce. Thanks for being a part of it all. I'll be back again very soon. Bye for now.